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A revamp of a Winty5 Original from January 2013, my first Top Pick ever, now featuring a full Basic Latin Character Set and real lowercase.

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    Created on 22nd May 2022. Last edited on 5th June 2022.
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    All Rights Reserved. No download available.
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17 Comments

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Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 23rd may 2022

A revamp of a Winty5 Original Classic from January 2013, my first Top Pick ever, originally known as 5Goldminer, now featuring a full Basic Latin Character Set and real lowercase. The original font from 2013 will still be free to download and use however you see fit, however this one I plan on selling, once I make better samples for it. The original one will always be free, it was posted on DaFont and many other such sites. Don't worry, link to buy this new one will be made available as soon as possible. The sample above is just a quick comparison image for my fellow font nerds. Let me know what you think of this redesign of an almost 10 year old project. Almost every glyph has been changed and redesigned completely and many new glyphs have been added, including a full lowercase, meaning this is basically its own almost entirely new font, although I tried to stay true to the spirit of the original font. My younger self would be proud (I think) I wanted to keep the original intact for historical purposes as I made it when I was 10(!). Hope you enjoy.

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 23rd may 2022

Considering applying to MyFonts.com once I flesh this one out a little more. Any advice?

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 23rd may 2022

Very crisp design and some very cool looking letterforms, would love to see the completed version for this work. I do have 2 things I'd like to point out in regard to the design choices you made.

1) Horizontal strokes and serif strokes aren't the same weight in the older font version, as can be seen in your first sample, causing some unalignement between the two, which I figure, you also noticed. For this particular font I totally agree with the fix you did, as I dont think the design benefits from it having this occasional inconsistencies. But yeah, I saw you fixed this, nice job!

Perhaps this is a nice idea for you,
I personaly would have choosen to make another clone and actually do two seporate styles variations. In one I would've replaced the serifs with a thicker one, exactly like you did as well. But, I also think there is great potential for a style variant that could easily made from the other solution, which is to make a vertical orientation of the weight axes, in other words making all hotizontal strokes equal to the half-weight serifs as were present in your first sample image.

2) Sidebearing metrics aren't aligned properly.
I don't know to what extend you already have knowledge about font metrics, but this one needs a little more indepth explaination on the subject though, but it is something that makes a huge difference further along, and one you might want to know prior of embarging on an endeavor to make commercial fonts in the future. (So, hereby my appologies in advance for the huge comment this is turning out to be)

Anyway, let's dive into it, and since your font is a serif style design, that is the subject I will cover. (So this doesn't apply to sans-serif style)

To start, serif style fonts are best to have horizontally center-aligned of the grid within a chosen character width. Lets say we design the 'M' (but applies to all ohter glyphs that include serifs as well e.g. Bb, D, E, Hh, Ii, Ll etc.) if the left side serif is aligned so that it sits flush to the guide for the left-sidebearing, this in response also should be mirrored and repeated the same way on the glyph's right-sidebearing. Now you have center-aligned your glyph, and by using this method the internal metrics are now correctly set in correlation to the grid, and ‘sort of’ parameter locked for that glyph.

Now, any roundish letterforms or bowls (e.g. Gg, Cc, Dd, Ee, Oo etc.) these should also be center-aligned, but with compensated left/right sidebearing metrics. Typically for these roundish letterforms is that they usually don't sit flush to the guides for sidebearing. A small section of extra space at both sides of such a glyph usually is what u want. This is simply to include a slight overshoot into the metric settings and compensates for any roundish letterforms, as well as to compensate for any extra horizontal space most serifs usually add to the glyph. Handling letterspacing this way bypasses the need for correcting each and every kerning pair individually afterward. So in Fontstruct terminology, this means that a glyph is supposed to be proportionally nudged to the left, followed by dragging the guide for "Letter width" at the right side of your glyph into the correct spot to achieve equal horizontal spacing left/right.

The issue presented when you align everything exclusively to the left side when doing serif fonts is, that you will end up with a font that has inconsistent horizontal letter spacing. Fixing this afterward by way of kerning is not what I would recommend, as this would be a tremendous task of correcting loads and loads of kerning pairs. Best is to start every new Fontstruction with a proper horizontally centered grid alignement for each of the glyphs. This way you don't run into Fontstruct-editor limitations when nudging entire glyphs or complex selections of bricks. Especially when working on very large glyph sets this potentially could save many many hrs of unnecessary extra work when having to fix this afterward.

And since you mentioned having ambitions for submitting this to MyFonts.com, there are a number of things you want to be sure that you tackle them correctly right from the start on out. With these metric settings probably being the single most important of all, as inconsistent font metrics could easily have your submission getting rejected at MyFonts.

I hope this will help you a little further towards your goal of making commercial pro fonts.

But nonetheless cool piece of work so far.

Cheers

Comment by Sed4tives 23rd may 2022

I appreciate the very detailed comment Sed4tives. I will go over every glyph and adjust the spacing as you stated. (I have already made custom kerning for the "f" glyph) To clarify, what you mean is for letters with serifs (like M, K) the spacing line should be touching the letter but letters without serifs (O, Q) the line should have one brick of space? |.O.| compared to |M| if you consider | to be the spacing line. I'm on my phone at the moment but I'll upload a screenshot once I get home 

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 23rd may 2022

I advice you to use this method prior of any kerning, if this font has already using kerned pairs you most likely end up making it even more messy and difficult to get a good grasp on whatever metrics distribution is going on. So if you want to apply the method to this specific font I suggest you start a empty new Fontstruction in a secondairy browser tab and copy all the glyphs from this font into the empty Fontstruction. This way you can be cetain there aren't any kerned pairs.

Since it is much easier to get a grasp on whatever is going on when you only have a small number of pairs that need kerning. Since when your grid alignement is done correctly, usually you will have only a small hand full of kerning vallues you need to deal with that can easily be copied from one glyph to another.

Just fool around with this a little to get a better understanding of the logic that lies underneath.

But be VERY careful (and this cannot be rephrased enough, lol) when u start doing this to any existing fonts, something I don't recommend when you're fairly new to this concept.

I do not want to be that guy that told you to do certain things that in the end only ruined your artwork. ;)

Comment by Sed4tives 23rd may 2022

[quote]

To clarify, what you mean is for letters with serifs (like M, K) the spacing line should be touching the letter but letters without serifs (O, Q) the line should have one brick of space?

[/quote]

==============================================================

This entirely depends on the design grid you work with as well as the stoke weights that are used. Small (like 2x2 grid units) fonts that use 2:2 filter settings usually only need one or two nudges. So with these types of designs the values for adjustment are very small.

But in general the rule here is, the more flesh there is available (so the thicker a stroke), the more room you have to implement any adjustments.

Large grid designs that dont make use of advanced brick/grid filters are much easier to adjust, since in these case you often simply can drag / drop a certain selection without much issues.

Cheers

Comment by Sed4tives 23rd may 2022

Hi Sed4tives, is this what you mean? Still not sure on if I'm interpreting what you want me to do correctly. This font is on a 1x1 grid (as I made the original when I was 10, and did not understand filters) Letters without serifs like the 0 are 12px wide. Letters with serifs on both sides (like H) are 14px wide.

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 24th may 2022
Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 6th june 2022
Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 6th june 2022
Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 6th june 2022

Update: Extended Latin A and all vulgar fractions completed. This font will be for sale on Creative Fabrica soon, stay tuned.

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 6th june 2022

Sample that I made showing pangrams in different languages. The Romanian one started with an accented letter, so I had to add space before that letter for the whole diacritic to show…

Comment by Bryndan W. Meyerholt (BWM) 6th june 2022

BWM, thanks for the sample. I only speak English (and a basic amount of Spanish) so hopefully my diacritics are more or less accurate. Yes, on letter Î the accent mark is larger then the letter which can create this problem.

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 8th june 2022

Dont worry too much about that, since this happens a lot, even in many commercial fonts this is often the case, and shouldnt have you make drastic changes, since its not very common for conflicting pairs to occure in many languages. More important is that the accents remain legible at smaller point size I think, thats also the reason for many designers to choose to leave it as is! ;)

Comment by Sed4tives 8th june 2022
Comment by Sed4tives 8th june 2022

Got it. I see what you mean. However, if I decrease the spacing any more letters will touch each other (which I don't want) and if I increase the spacing any more letters will be too far apart then I originally intended. I may mess around with this more in a clone, your sample does show a pretty large difference between "mp" and "ps" but as for now I'm considering this font to be done.

Comment by Noah F. Ross (winty5) 8th june 2022

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